"A lot" as in hardly any. Most of the big critics loved it, it is just the "fans" who hate it!
Right. But the big critics don't matter. By definition it is the fans for whom the movie is made, and it is their opinion that needs to be respected.
Being a fan of a franchise doesn't mean blindly loving everything it puts out. Being a fan of a franchise means loving the franchise itself -- and wanting the best for it.
As it happens, fans know that TLJ is not the best movie for them.
Technically, the big critics matter a lotttttttt, IDK were you got that info, no offense. I do see what your talking about though.
I get what you're saying and totally agree. It's ridiculous to assume that every little detail must pay off somehow. So while I don't think that it's entirely fair to use this principle on things like rifles on the wall, for big story beats and plot twists, it should be applied.
And how is a hug important to the story?
It's not too important, I never said it was. Although it does help to further establish Leia's mental connection with other Force users like Rey, and shows a little bit of bittersweet mourning for Han's death.
Even so they could have at least aknowleged Hans death better.
They acknowledged his death enough. What if there was a random scene where Leia, or Luke, or Rey or even Chewie sat down and felt sad about Han? It would be boring and detract from the movie.
Speaking of chewie... he got no screentime.
Whatsoever.
And the scenes of him with the porgs don't really count
Right. But the big critics don't matter. By definition it is the fans for whom the movie is made, and it is their opinion that needs to be respected.
Being a fan of a franchise doesn't mean blindly loving everything it puts out. Being a fan of a franchise means loving the franchise itself -- and wanting the best for it.
As it happens, fans know that TLJ is not the best movie for them.
Technically, the big critics matter a lotttttttt, IDK were you got that info, no offense. I do see what your talking about though.
Look at it this way, who's opinion do you trust more:
A guy in a suit who doesn't really care about Star Wars and judges a movie solely on its own merits, regardless of whether it is a sequel to a superior original work.
Or a fan who saw the movie, saw flaws in it, and is able to point out how to contradicts past continuity.
See, the fan's emotional investment is greater, and often it is the true fans of a franchise that give the important points of criticism that actually matter. A lot of the things in the Last Jedi that don't sit well with a fan are going to simply fly over the heads of a detached professional who doesn't know all that much about Star Wars.
Also -- if you're really curious, I got my info from common sense and logic Just by looking at the situation, I can make generalizations about who will be the better critics of a movie, crazy, right?
Now, sometimes, the reverse is also true: Fans might love a movie, but critics will hate it. A perfect example of this is the brilliant work UHF. Fans of Weird Al ended up loving it, but critics who were thinking too professionally going into the movie didn't get its humor.
In short: critics don't really matter. The masses who actually watch the movie and judge it for themselves from different points of views are the ones whose opinions actually matter, because they're the ones who are going to have the most emotional investment in a given work.
This is all I'm trying to get across
If you still want to read reviews by professional critics, that's okay: but make sure you also think for yourself. Don't let a critic stop you from watching a good movie, and don't let a critic encourage you to watch a bad one. Make your own judgements, it's the only real way to know whether you'll like a movie or not.
It's not too important, I never said it was. Although it does help to further establish Leia's mental connection with other Force users like Rey, and shows a little bit of bittersweet mourning for Han's death.
It’s nothing, and based on the discussion we just held Chekhov’s Gun does not apply to it.
They acknowledged his death enough. What if there was a random scene where Leia, or Luke, or Rey or even Chewie sat down and felt sad about Han? It would be boring and detract from the movie.
Speaking of chewie... he got no screentime.
Whatsoever.
And the scenes of him with the porgs don't really count
Technically, the big critics matter a lotttttttt, IDK were you got that info, no offense. I do see what your talking about though.
Look at it this way, who's opinion do you trust more:
A guy in a suit who doesn't really care about Star Wars and judges a movie solely on its own merits, regardless of whether it is a sequel to a superior original work.
Or a fan who saw the movie, saw flaws in it, and is able to point out how to contradicts past continuity.
See, the fan's emotional investment is greater, and often it is the true fans of a franchise that give the important points of criticism that actually matter. A lot of the things in the Last Jedi that don't sit well with a fan are going to simply fly over the heads of a detached professional who doesn't know all that much about Star Wars.
Also -- if you're really curious, I got my info from common sense and logic Just by looking at the situation, I can make generalizations about who will be the better critics of a movie, crazy, right?
Now, sometimes, the reverse is also true: Fans might love a movie, but critics will hate it. A perfect example of this is the brilliant work UHF. Fans of Weird Al ended up loving it, but critics who were thinking too professionally going into the movie didn't get its humor.
In short: critics don't really matter. The masses who actually watch the movie and judge it for themselves from different points of views are the ones whose opinions actually matter, because they're the ones who are going to have the most emotional investment in a given work.
This is all I'm trying to get across
If you still want to read reviews by professional critics, that's okay: but make sure you also think for yourself. Don't let a critic stop you from watching a good movie, and don't let a critic encourage you to watch a bad one. Make your own judgements, it's the only real way to know whether you'll like a movie or not.
Who’s opinion do you trust more?
A professional critic who has watched countless movies and knows what’s bad and what isn’t.
OR
A mindless fan who goes into a movie expecting explosions and A-List actors and only wants fan service.
Look at it this way, who's opinion do you trust more:
A guy in a suit who doesn't really care about Star Wars and judges a movie solely on its own merits, regardless of whether it is a sequel to a superior original work.
Or a fan who saw the movie, saw flaws in it, and is able to point out how to contradicts past continuity.
See, the fan's emotional investment is greater, and often it is the true fans of a franchise that give the important points of criticism that actually matter. A lot of the things in the Last Jedi that don't sit well with a fan are going to simply fly over the heads of a detached professional who doesn't know all that much about Star Wars.
Also -- if you're really curious, I got my info from common sense and logic Just by looking at the situation, I can make generalizations about who will be the better critics of a movie, crazy, right?
Now, sometimes, the reverse is also true: Fans might love a movie, but critics will hate it. A perfect example of this is the brilliant work UHF. Fans of Weird Al ended up loving it, but critics who were thinking too professionally going into the movie didn't get its humor.
In short: critics don't really matter. The masses who actually watch the movie and judge it for themselves from different points of views are the ones whose opinions actually matter, because they're the ones who are going to have the most emotional investment in a given work.
This is all I'm trying to get across
If you still want to read reviews by professional critics, that's okay: but make sure you also think for yourself. Don't let a critic stop you from watching a good movie, and don't let a critic encourage you to watch a bad one. Make your own judgements, it's the only real way to know whether you'll like a movie or not.
Who’s opinion do you trust more?
A professional critic who has watched countless movies and knows what’s bad and what isn’t.
OR
A mindless fan who goes into a movie expecting explosions and A-List actors and only wants fan service.
Neither. A third option.
A mindful fan who goes into a movie, pays attention to it, and develops a thoughtful opinion on it with supporting evidence and detail. It doesn't matter if the opinion is bad or good so long as it is accurate.
People who blindly praise this movie are wrong, they likely don't understand Star Wars or are just too trusting and willing to like it.
People who blindly hate this movie are also wrong. They don't use thoughtful arguments and do not give the movie credit where credit is due.
There are people in the middle, however, who actually are thoughtful, and those are the people who's opinions I trust.
Z-whales, for example: while we disagree on several points, I appreciate his arguments as they are well thought-out and articulated. At the end of the day: this is a polarizing movie. There is no way around that fact. It has bad elements, and good elements, and it's important to acknowledge both before coming to a conclusion.
A professional critic who has watched countless movies and knows what’s bad and what isn’t.
OR
A mindless fan who goes into a movie expecting explosions and A-List actors and only wants fan service.
Neither. A third option.
A mindful fan who goes into a movie, pays attention to it, and develops a thoughtful opinion on it with supporting evidence and detail. It doesn't matter if the opinion is bad or good so long as it is accurate.
People who blindly praise this movie are wrong, they likely don't understand Star Wars or are just too trusting and willing to like it.
People who blindly hate this movie are also wrong. They don't use thoughtful arguments and do not give the movie credit where credit is due.
There are people in the middle, however, who actually are thoughtful, and those are the people who's opinions I trust.
Z-whales, for example: while we disagree on several points, I appreciate his arguments as they are well thought-out and articulated. At the end of the day: this is a polarizing movie. There is no way around that fact. It has bad elements, and good elements, and it's important to acknowledge both before coming to a conclusion.
If that is so, I’d recommend listening to IHE’s thoughts on the movie. He is a Star Wars fan, but provides reasonable arguments for why he likes the movie.
A mindful fan who goes into a movie, pays attention to it, and develops a thoughtful opinion on it with supporting evidence and detail. It doesn't matter if the opinion is bad or good so long as it is accurate.
People who blindly praise this movie are wrong, they likely don't understand Star Wars or are just too trusting and willing to like it.
People who blindly hate this movie are also wrong. They don't use thoughtful arguments and do not give the movie credit where credit is due.
There are people in the middle, however, who actually are thoughtful, and those are the people who's opinions I trust.
Z-whales, for example: while we disagree on several points, I appreciate his arguments as they are well thought-out and articulated. At the end of the day: this is a polarizing movie. There is no way around that fact. It has bad elements, and good elements, and it's important to acknowledge both before coming to a conclusion.
If that is so, I’d recommend listening to IHE’s thoughts on the movie. He is a Star Wars fan, but provides reasonable arguments for why he likes the movie.
-last edited on Apr 1, 2018 6:40:35 GMT by junior-chan
Post by junior-chan on Apr 1, 2018 6:38:08 GMT
There's some legitimately huge plot holes, the Resistance as a whole is a boring faction, the Canto Bight thing was pointless both in the plot and the film, the writing for Rose was bad(I personally didn't mind the acting), Kylo's still a whiny brat after killing the Supreme Leader, and there is no way Phasma should have been killed that easily.
On the plus side, Rey is definitely out of Mary Sue territory at this point.
Technically, the big critics matter a lotttttttt, IDK were you got that info, no offense. I do see what your talking about though.
Look at it this way, who's opinion do you trust more:
A guy in a suit who doesn't really care about Star Wars and judges a movie solely on its own merits, regardless of whether it is a sequel to a superior original work.
Or a fan who saw the movie, saw flaws in it, and is able to point out how to contradicts past continuity.
See, the fan's emotional investment is greater, and often it is the true fans of a franchise that give the important points of criticism that actually matter. A lot of the things in the Last Jedi that don't sit well with a fan are going to simply fly over the heads of a detached professional who doesn't know all that much about Star Wars.
Also -- if you're really curious, I got my info from common sense and logic Just by looking at the situation, I can make generalizations about who will be the better critics of a movie, crazy, right?
Now, sometimes, the reverse is also true: Fans might love a movie, but critics will hate it. A perfect example of this is the brilliant work UHF. Fans of Weird Al ended up loving it, but critics who were thinking too professionally going into the movie didn't get its humor.
In short: critics don't really matter. The masses who actually watch the movie and judge it for themselves from different points of views are the ones whose opinions actually matter, because they're the ones who are going to have the most emotional investment in a given work.
This is all I'm trying to get across
If you still want to read reviews by professional critics, that's okay: but make sure you also think for yourself. Don't let a critic stop you from watching a good movie, and don't let a critic encourage you to watch a bad one. Make your own judgements, it's the only real way to know whether you'll like a movie or not.
Don't worry, I won't let a critic do that! I just thought it was a pretty good movie. BTW, I was not trying to start in argument!
It's not too important, I never said it was. Although it does help to further establish Leia's mental connection with other Force users like Rey, and shows a little bit of bittersweet mourning for Han's death.
It’s nothing, and based on the discussion we just held Chekhov’s Gun does not apply to it.
I mean, sure, I guess that hug is never specifically brought up again later. That's why I find the wording of the Chekhov's Gun principle to be a little stupid when taken at face value.
BTW, I was not trying to start in argument!