OOC: True, but the sentries could see them coming.
Sentries are one of the obvious things that go without saying. I don't have to say that there are sentries, just as we don't mention the large force of cooks, smiths, supply carts, etc. that accompany every army. My troops going to the eating area, the sleeping area and the toilets every day is a movement, yet we don't say those. It's just so obvious that it doesn't need to be said.
The sentries are positioned is such a manner that they can keep an eye on the edges of the leveled area and and a few buildings out. You said your forces were on the outskirts of it.
OOC: Eventually, but only when they were close enough - there are still lots of buildings standing, you know.
Alright, fair enough.
The outskirts but I figured it went without saying that they would be avoiding sentries. When I said they dispatched any orcs in their way, I meant small groups of orcs, not sentries. They're trying to go unnoticed for as long as possible. Shall we just say they got to their position north of your forces, and then when they moved towards the levelled area the sentries spotted them?
{JAMMERS! -Good- ONLY!}Got it. I have 250 shock troops for the first charge, and 750 axemen behind them. I also have a lot of Pikemen that I'll organize into Phalanxes before the charge. I also have 2,000 Archers, which should be useful.
Where should the Scorpions go?
Explain to him how he can't possibly see my Rangers with so much ease.
OOC: Shamrock, what siege engines do you have here? Also, how much longer until the sun rises?
IC: A noble blast from a trumpet rings out, and it is answered with a mighty shout from the host of Gondor. They begin marching through the city towards enemy lines.
The Guards of Osgiliath go first, with the Axemen of Lossarnach behind. After them march the Harvagor Soldiers, followed by two squares of 500 Pikemen. Behind them march 2,000 Gondorian Archers, with a separate rank of Heavy Crossbowmen. There are Scorpions spread evenly throughout their ranks as well.
150 of the Harvagor Soldiers are carrying wooden barricades. Each one is 20 feet long (6 meters) and 7 feet tall (2.13 meters), enough for several dozen men to hide behind. The front of each barricade features 20 wooden stakes 5 feet in length (1.5 meters) that end in a razor-sharp point.
*While then other events occurred, the elven trebuchets had quietly been moved into range. Now, as the enemy siege engines are directed away from them, the trebuchets open fire on them, smashing several and then reloading.*
*The elven force continuously shifts their position, avoiding the enemy projectiles as best they can. The superior elven archers make quick work of groups of orc archers they face, while the Maethyr I-Thewair take out any close-range combatants.*
OOC: Everything in range of the war engines has been leveled; it order to have a chance of hitting them, you'd need to move yours into the open, which would involve being seen.
Also, your trebuchets cannot move about much. They're very hard to move, as are their projectiles. It takes long enough to reload them without moving them through rubble; you'd only have gotten one shot from each at this point it they're moving much. If you want to make sitting ducks out your trebuchets by having them crawl along, unable to fire, that's fine by me, though.
IC: The Mordor War Engines turn to face them. Because of how long it takes to move the elven trebuchets, this would probably be before the trebuchets finish moving from their first positions and reload. They open fire, doing heavy damage to the elves.
OOC: Sorry I didn't get back to this yesterday, I didn't have time.
Here's the thing, I don't think you levelled the entire area. One, that's almost as OP as burning a large forest. Two, LB was gone from the RP on vaca and for other such reasons. The entire RP came to a standstill, and making moves like that while your opponent is inactive is not allowed. I do grant that you've damaged a significant amount of the area, but saying you've levelled everything in range of the trebuchets is completely OP. Now we might have wait a little, because I'd like KitKat's opinion on this, since he's the RP rep. KitKat, what do you think - is this allowed?
I know they are slow. But assuming my above argument stands, they'd have buildings concealing their movement, your orcs would be distracted by the assault from the north and south, and wouldn't be looking for something they didn't even know was in the city.
I'd like to request a pause in all combat until this is resolved. LegoBuilder, you may stand down for now.
OOC: Everything in range of the war engines has been leveled; it order to have a chance of hitting them, you'd need to move yours into the open, which would involve being seen.
Also, your trebuchets cannot move about much. They're very hard to move, as are their projectiles. It takes long enough to reload them without moving them through rubble; you'd only have gotten one shot from each at this point it they're moving much. If you want to make sitting ducks out your trebuchets by having them crawl along, unable to fire, that's fine by me, though.
IC: The Mordor War Engines turn to face them. Because of how long it takes to move the elven trebuchets, this would probably be before the trebuchets finish moving from their first positions and reload. They open fire, doing heavy damage to the elves.
OOC: Sorry I didn't get back to this yesterday, I didn't have time.
Here's the thing, I don't think you levelled the entire area. One, that's almost as OP as burning a large forest. Two, LB was gone from the RP on vaca and for other such reasons. The entire RP came to a standstill, and making moves like that while your opponent is inactive is not allowed. I do grant that you've damaged a significant amount of the area, but saying you've levelled everything in range of the trebuchets is completely OP. Now we might have wait a little, because I'd like KitKat's opinion on this, since he's the RP rep. KitKat , what do you think - is this allowed?
I know they are slow. But assuming my above argument stands, they'd have buildings concealing their movement, your orcs would be distracted by the assault from the north and south, and wouldn't be looking for something they didn't even know was in the city.
I'd like to request a pause in all combat until this is resolved. LegoBuilder , you may stand down for now.
I think I'd agree. I'm not going to make a call on legality right now, but I don't think Sham's had the time to level the area yet. Sham, you've got, what, eight onagers and ten trebuchets? If the average range of a trebuchet is three hundred meters (we'll bump the radius of our circle up to three hundred and fifty since your weapons would be spread out slightly), that gives you about twenty-two hundred square meters to clear. Drop seven hundred meters as road and you have fifteen hundred meters of building. If a single projectile takes out nine square meters of building (or a ten-foot square, which is honestly pretty big), then you'll need about two hundred shots to clear the area (assuming thirty-five-ish misses/poor hits). From what I've found, trebuchets tend to only get off a couple shots per hour, and while onagers are faster they wouldn't do as much damage. We'll go with an average of three shots an hour (onagers actually firing more, but doing the equivalent of three shots). With eighteen weapons, that gives you fifty-four shots an hour, taking you four hours to clear the area. So have these weapons been left undisturbed for a full four hours of battle-time since crossing the river? Oh, and actually, the trebuchets would have to be disassembled for transport and then reassembled after they've crossed the river. So you can add in at least another hour or two of construction time after they've been moved.
And lastly, this is just for mostly destroying the buildings. If you want to truly level the area to the point where there's absolutely nothing to hide behind, you'd need to add in a couple more hours of firing (because each shot won't level as much, and more and more will miss), plus plenty of troops to go around and manually clean up what the artillery just can't do.
A large contingent of Gondorian siege engines enter the city and begin moving through it on the paths cleared by the previous garrisons. The trebuchets set up out of range of Mordor's trebuchets (but in their range) and begin firing large fragments of buildings and walls found throughout the area.
OOC: The trebuchets are Gondorian trebuchets, which are superior to normal trebuchets in power, range, and accuracy. They have a bit faster loading time but not by much. They cost 20 MWE, not 15.
OOC: Everything in range of the war engines has been leveled; it order to have a chance of hitting them, you'd need to move yours into the open, which would involve being seen.
Also, your trebuchets cannot move about much. They're very hard to move, as are their projectiles. It takes long enough to reload them without moving them through rubble; you'd only have gotten one shot from each at this point it they're moving much. If you want to make sitting ducks out your trebuchets by having them crawl along, unable to fire, that's fine by me, though.
IC: The Mordor War Engines turn to face them. Because of how long it takes to move the elven trebuchets, this would probably be before the trebuchets finish moving from their first positions and reload. They open fire, doing heavy damage to the elves.
OOC: Sorry I didn't get back to this yesterday, I didn't have time.
Here's the thing, I don't think you levelled the entire area. One, that's almost as OP as burning a large forest. Two, LB was gone from the RP on vaca and for other such reasons. The entire RP came to a standstill, and making moves like that while your opponent is inactive is not allowed. I do grant that you've damaged a significant amount of the area, but saying you've levelled everything in range of the trebuchets is completely OP. Now we might have wait a little, because I'd like KitKat's opinion on this, since he's the RP rep. KitKat , what do you think - is this allowed?
I know they are slow. But assuming my above argument stands, they'd have buildings concealing their movement, your orcs would be distracted by the assault from the north and south, and wouldn't be looking for something they didn't even know was in the city.
I'd like to request a pause in all combat until this is resolved. LegoBuilder , you may stand down for now.
OOC: No problem.
Well, no, I haven't levelled it in the sense of making it utterly flat. What I have done is smashed all buildings of any reasonable size up a bit, and had orcs clear most small to mid-sized rubble. There are still bits of building and large boulders scattered about, but not anything capable of hiding a trebuchet, and not enough to allow a large force to approach unseen, especially as there are orcs throughout the area.
There's enough cover to allow a few scouts to get close to Orcish lines, yes. But in order to hide a trebuchet, you'd need large buildings, which are the ones destroyed by my war engines. There's also the fact that your own argument hinders your own move. The movement of massive things like trebuchets would be very difficult on terrain covered in rubble. Of course, there's not much rubble, but there is some, especially on the edges of the circle. As for your point that the Orcs wouldn't be looking, forgive me if I'm wrong, but I don't think any of the attacks are major ones that would draw the attention of my full force. All Orcs in the areas of the attacks would be occupied, but that leaves many more that are not.
OOC: Sorry I didn't get back to this yesterday, I didn't have time.
Here's the thing, I don't think you levelled the entire area. One, that's almost as OP as burning a large forest. Two, LB was gone from the RP on vaca and for other such reasons. The entire RP came to a standstill, and making moves like that while your opponent is inactive is not allowed. I do grant that you've damaged a significant amount of the area, but saying you've levelled everything in range of the trebuchets is completely OP. Now we might have wait a little, because I'd like KitKat's opinion on this, since he's the RP rep. KitKat , what do you think - is this allowed?
I know they are slow. But assuming my above argument stands, they'd have buildings concealing their movement, your orcs would be distracted by the assault from the north and south, and wouldn't be looking for something they didn't even know was in the city.
I'd like to request a pause in all combat until this is resolved. LegoBuilder , you may stand down for now.
I think I'd agree. I'm not going to make a call on legality right now, but I don't think Sham's had the time to level the area yet. Sham, you've got, what, eight onagers and ten trebuchets? If the average range of a trebuchet is three hundred meters (we'll bump the radius of our circle up to three hundred and fifty since your weapons would be spread out slightly), that gives you about twenty-two hundred square meters to clear. Drop seven hundred meters as road and you have fifteen hundred meters of building. If a single projectile takes out nine square meters of building (or a ten-foot square, which is honestly pretty big), then you'll need about two hundred shots to clear the area (assuming thirty-five-ish misses/poor hits). From what I've found, trebuchets tend to only get off a couple shots per hour, and while onagers are faster they wouldn't do as much damage. We'll go with an average of three shots an hour (onagers actually firing more, but doing the equivalent of three shots). With eighteen weapons, that gives you fifty-four shots an hour, taking you four hours to clear the area. So have these weapons been left undisturbed for a full four hours of battle-time since crossing the river? Oh, and actually, the trebuchets would have to be disassembled for transport and then reassembled after they've crossed the river. So you can add in at least another hour or two of construction time after they've been moved.
And lastly, this is just for mostly destroying the buildings. If you want to truly level the area to the point where there's absolutely nothing to hide behind, you'd need to add in a couple more hours of firing (because each shot won't level as much, and more and more will miss), plus plenty of troops to go around and manually clean up what the artillery just can't do.
On the time, my impression was that my troops crossed the river days before the current battle. After losing the river, the Gondorians would have been in disarray, meaning it would take several hours, most of the time required, for them to regroup, and planning the new attack with the elves would take hours more. The Gondorians would also have needed to repair broken weapons and armour, and bandage their wounds. This may be completely wrong, but I thought time progressed unless otherwise stated. Unless I am thoroughly mistaken, logic dictates that days, if not weeks, have passed since my crossing of the river.
Yes, I believe I haven't been detailed enough with my explanations. By levelled, I was simply using the best phrase I could think of. What I have been doing is hitting all major buildings with siege engines, whilst Orcs cleared all minor to mid-sized rubble, and brought back what large objects they could for use as ammunition. There are still chunks of building and some boulders it simply wasn't worthwhile to move lying around, but enough have been moved that no significant numbers of foes could get through when there are a large number of Orcs standing around.
I think I'd agree. I'm not going to make a call on legality right now, but I don't think Sham's had the time to level the area yet. Sham, you've got, what, eight onagers and ten trebuchets? If the average range of a trebuchet is three hundred meters (we'll bump the radius of our circle up to three hundred and fifty since your weapons would be spread out slightly), that gives you about twenty-two hundred square meters to clear. Drop seven hundred meters as road and you have fifteen hundred meters of building. If a single projectile takes out nine square meters of building (or a ten-foot square, which is honestly pretty big), then you'll need about two hundred shots to clear the area (assuming thirty-five-ish misses/poor hits). From what I've found, trebuchets tend to only get off a couple shots per hour, and while onagers are faster they wouldn't do as much damage. We'll go with an average of three shots an hour (onagers actually firing more, but doing the equivalent of three shots). With eighteen weapons, that gives you fifty-four shots an hour, taking you four hours to clear the area. So have these weapons been left undisturbed for a full four hours of battle-time since crossing the river? Oh, and actually, the trebuchets would have to be disassembled for transport and then reassembled after they've crossed the river. So you can add in at least another hour or two of construction time after they've been moved.
And lastly, this is just for mostly destroying the buildings. If you want to truly level the area to the point where there's absolutely nothing to hide behind, you'd need to add in a couple more hours of firing (because each shot won't level as much, and more and more will miss), plus plenty of troops to go around and manually clean up what the artillery just can't do.
On the time, my impression was that my troops crossed the river days before the current battle. After losing the river, the Gondorians would have been in disarray, meaning it would take several hours, most of the time required, for them to regroup, and planning the new attack with the elves would take hours more. The Gondorians would also have needed to repair broken weapons and armour, and bandage their wounds. This may be completely wrong, but I thought time progressed unless otherwise stated. Unless I am thoroughly mistaken, logic dictates that days, if not weeks, have passed since my crossing of the river.
Yes, I believe I haven't been detailed enough with my explanations. By levelled, I was simply using the best phrase I could think of. What I have been doing is hitting all major buildings with siege engines, whilst Orcs cleared all minor to mid-sized rubble, and brought back what large objects they could for use as ammunition. There are still chunks of building and some boulders it simply wasn't worthwhile to move lying around, but enough have been moved that no significant numbers of foes could get through when there are a large number of Orcs standing around.
But we don't mention that stuff, just like we don't care about smiths, cooks, and such. The Gondorians did fall back, but there really weren't that many at the wall to begin with. It was just siege engines, because they had built a large wall to keep out infantry assaults.
I think I'd agree. I'm not going to make a call on legality right now, but I don't think Sham's had the time to level the area yet. Sham, you've got, what, eight onagers and ten trebuchets? If the average range of a trebuchet is three hundred meters (we'll bump the radius of our circle up to three hundred and fifty since your weapons would be spread out slightly), that gives you about twenty-two hundred square meters to clear. Drop seven hundred meters as road and you have fifteen hundred meters of building. If a single projectile takes out nine square meters of building (or a ten-foot square, which is honestly pretty big), then you'll need about two hundred shots to clear the area (assuming thirty-five-ish misses/poor hits). From what I've found, trebuchets tend to only get off a couple shots per hour, and while onagers are faster they wouldn't do as much damage. We'll go with an average of three shots an hour (onagers actually firing more, but doing the equivalent of three shots). With eighteen weapons, that gives you fifty-four shots an hour, taking you four hours to clear the area. So have these weapons been left undisturbed for a full four hours of battle-time since crossing the river? Oh, and actually, the trebuchets would have to be disassembled for transport and then reassembled after they've crossed the river. So you can add in at least another hour or two of construction time after they've been moved.
And lastly, this is just for mostly destroying the buildings. If you want to truly level the area to the point where there's absolutely nothing to hide behind, you'd need to add in a couple more hours of firing (because each shot won't level as much, and more and more will miss), plus plenty of troops to go around and manually clean up what the artillery just can't do.
On the time, my impression was that my troops crossed the river days before the current battle. After losing the river, the Gondorians would have been in disarray, meaning it would take several hours, most of the time required, for them to regroup, and planning the new attack with the elves would take hours more. The Gondorians would also have needed to repair broken weapons and armour, and bandage their wounds. This may be completely wrong, but I thought time progressed unless otherwise stated. Unless I am thoroughly mistaken, logic dictates that days, if not weeks, have passed since my crossing of the river.
Yes, I believe I haven't been detailed enough with my explanations. By levelled, I was simply using the best phrase I could think of. What I have been doing is hitting all major buildings with siege engines, whilst Orcs cleared all minor to mid-sized rubble, and brought back what large objects they could for use as ammunition. There are still chunks of building and some boulders it simply wasn't worthwhile to move lying around, but enough have been moved that no significant numbers of foes could get through when there are a large number of Orcs standing around.
In that case, you guys will have to sort things out amongst yourselves. I don't know enough of what's been going on and who's trying to do what to really say much.
On the time, my impression was that my troops crossed the river days before the current battle. After losing the river, the Gondorians would have been in disarray, meaning it would take several hours, most of the time required, for them to regroup, and planning the new attack with the elves would take hours more. The Gondorians would also have needed to repair broken weapons and armour, and bandage their wounds. This may be completely wrong, but I thought time progressed unless otherwise stated. Unless I am thoroughly mistaken, logic dictates that days, if not weeks, have passed since my crossing of the river.
Yes, I believe I haven't been detailed enough with my explanations. By levelled, I was simply using the best phrase I could think of. What I have been doing is hitting all major buildings with siege engines, whilst Orcs cleared all minor to mid-sized rubble, and brought back what large objects they could for use as ammunition. There are still chunks of building and some boulders it simply wasn't worthwhile to move lying around, but enough have been moved that no significant numbers of foes could get through when there are a large number of Orcs standing around.
But we don't mention that stuff, just like we don't care about smiths, cooks, and such. The Gondorians did fall back, but there really weren't that many at the wall to begin with. It was just siege engines, because they had built a large wall to keep out infantry assaults.
OK, point taken and accepted. However, no battle was going on for an extended period, so I see no reason for time not to have progressed. Why would it just freeze when no battle is happening?
OOC: Sauron had a physical form. He had four fingers. Gollum said so.
How can one plot to take over Middle-earth without a good mahogany desk?
OOC: Wouldn't he have 9 fingers? No. Thankfully, Gondor has no shortage of good mahogany. There's also this nice oak desk in my war room, you should come over and try it sometime.
OOC: He would. But only four on the Black Hand. Ah, how nice of you. I'll come tomorrow. I must return the favour and invite your entire court to a party in Orodruin. It would be such a shame if a treacherous Gondorian attacked the party guests, and the resulting struggle resulted in everyone falling into the Cracks of Doom.
