Ok, just making sure. We should have engough since the regions provide a 65000+ MWE plus 12 HQ's each with 20000 MWE and their sub HQ with 10000 MWE that is over 400000 MWE. More than engough.
I don't want things to get too complicated, but what if we cut everything in half? HQs get 10,000, subs get 5,000, regions grant 500?
Ok that works for me. Do we want Rhun to get the gold armored troops from the TT?
That's up to whoever the leader is. I see no problem in having that sort of styling for Rhun, nor is there a problem with ditching that and going with something else. As far as I can tell, it's just the aesthetic of those troops, which isn't too important.
Ok, but that is simi-heavy armor, I don't think lion used them but I think others might. You just said to have ruhn be made of cav archers, not infantry and I wanted to make sure it passed the KK test. I think they should get a heavy cav unit. If you look up "rhun Kataphracts you shoud see what i'm talking about.
We've set HQ's and added a new sub HQ feature which is more or less a half HQ and would be apart of a main HQ. CC has also been working on a map so we have been geting the regions for that. Plus a few HQ's have been clamed. Here is the HQ list.
Lots of stuff, ok. I'll take your point one by one.
The Crossroads is on the map. It is in the inset I added of Ithilien, due to the regions being too small to get names in there adequately.
Pelennor fields and Belfalas were certainly not in the old RP, nor should they be in this one.
I can certainly change weather hills to Lone lands.
The Eastfold and Westfold were very small, and were actually smaller divisions within the West/east emnets. It's a common misconception, so I decided to right it, and call them by their true names.
I saw a void where Nindalf was, and figured there wouldn't be any harm adding it in. If you'd like it to be named Noman lands instead, I can do so.
As far as Rhovanion is concerned, I can do some readjustments, but making Rhovanion three separate topic seems excessive.
Most of those adjustments seem fair. As far as Crossroads/morgul vale goes, I have the inset to see that region better. Morgul vale was just too small to fit in, and to be honest, I don't see a reason to have it.
I saw that, though I didn't notice a (clear) label for it (on either the main map or the inset).
I thought they were, but maybe not. I don't know much about Belfalas, but I think if we keep the Morgul Vale and the Black Gate as separate regions, it would be good to include the Pelennor Fields. If we're giving Barad-dur and Minas Morgul each their own entry regions, I think we should give Minas Tirith one too.
That'd be good, just to keep things as much the same as before for the sake of keeping things clear.
I figured it was something like that, but I'm not too knowledgeable about much south of Dol Guldur. I do think it would be good to separate the southern section of the West Emnet into another region though (next to Anorien), just from a geographical/logistical standpoint.
Insert third paragraph here.
Rhovanion was a huge area. From what I can tell, it covered about a hundred and fifty thousand square miles (three hundred by five hundred miles) from Mirkwood to Dorwinion, Celduin to the Ash Mountains. I would offer that we give the area some other names, except that all of the maps I've seen are pretty much blank in the area I just mentioned. Dorwinion was relatively small and was tucked between the Sea of Rhun and the River Running, while the Brown Lands end at the eastern edge of Mirkwood. The empty space in between can really only be called "Rhovanion". So on that, I suggest you tuck Dorwinion into the space between the Sea of Rhun and where you currently have it (and between the River Running and those mountains to the south) (as is canonical), combine your current Dorwinion and East Rhovanion into West Rhovanion (or north) (and maybe separate the East Bight, too), and then make the empty space just below all of that into Southern Rhovanion.
And that's good, I just could find the labels very well in there. I remember us having the Morgul Vale before, so I thought I'd bring it up.
@you and 8L: On the subject of the area around the Anduin, I think the number of regions we have is pretty good. I think we should rename CC's West Rhovanion to Vales of the Anduin to make it clear that it's away from the other Rhovanions, but otherwise it looks good to me. We do need to figure out exactly where the Beorning HQ will go, though. As far as I can tell, Beorn's hall was just east of the Carrock, and as Beorn was known to frequent the Carrock, I think it could be made into their HQ fairly well (combined with the nearby land, including the hall). separate the HQ a little, we could make the rest of the current Carrock region into the Wilderland.
Fixed Crossroads
I was always opposed to Morgul vale existing, it just seems like extra Morgul troops. But I suppose we can add in a Pelennor to counter that. (As long as we actually have the Rammas Echor ) Belfalas I know, as leader of Dol Amroth, was never part of the RP.
I added an East Fold region bordering Anorien, East Emnet, West Emnet and Edoras. I don't know if you want a West Fold too?
I fixed Rhovanion, as I will show in the next map.
First off, great job on the map, CC! And also, thanks EE for the above list!
Second, I just cross-references said map and above list. You might notice that most of the regions listed above are crossed out, and that's from my referencing them to CC's map. Each crossed-out region is both on the list (obviously) and the map. There are also a few with asterisks and whatever you call that other little thingy. The asterisks are just name things, while the other marks are for some actual changes/notes on the map.
But anyways, this is the list of regions that were on the map, but not the above list (and most of them I remember being in the old RP).
Forlindon (excluded from the old RP)
Harlindon (excluded from the old RP)
North Ered Luin
South Ered Luin
Old Forest
Forodwaith
Tharbad
Dimrill Dale
Helm's Deep
Dagorlad
Anorien
Henneth Annun
Cair Andros
Emyn Arnen
Cirith Ungol
Crossings of Poros
Pelargir
Tolfalas
(HQs/subs not on list):
Bree
Rivendell
Isengard
Moria
Gundabad
Mirkwood
Dol Guldur
Lothlorien
Fangorn
Edoras
Erebor
Dale
Rhun
Minas Morgul
Minas Tirith
Barad-dur
Harad
Umbar
Dol Amroth
Regions on list but not map:
Adorn
Regions on neither the map nor the list, but have been brought into my mind and I think were in the old RP:
Redhorn Pass
Belfalas
Crossroads
East Bight (?)
Pelennor Fields
Misty Mountains/Goblin-town (sub-HQ)
Name stuffs:
Weather Hills: Although this is on the map, it isn't on EE's list, and I don't recall it being in the old RP. We did, however, have the Lone-lands, which I believe were nearby, and could serve as the same region.
West Emnet/East Emnet: Neither of these regions were in EE's list either. However, EE mention the Westfold/Eastfold, and although these locations are slightly different, they could be interchangeable for our purposes (I don't remember what we did in the old RP). Actually, I think the Eastfold was south of the East Emnet, and west of Anorien (on the map, the part of West Emnet south of Edoras).
Nindalf: Again, not in EE's list, nor was it in the old RP. But as EE mentioned, the map is missing Noman's Land, which is nearby and could cover the same area.
Notes:
West/East/South Rhovanion: On CC's map, West Rhovanion is between Mirkwood and the Anduin, East Rhovanion is directly on the eastern side of Mirkwood, and there's a gap where South Rhovanion should be. In the old RP, West Rhovanion was where East Rhovanion and Dorwinion are on the map (Dorwinion, I think, was just in that little bit below the River Running that says "Sea of Rhun"), South Rhovanion was between West Rhovanion and the northern mountains of Mordor, and I think we had some other region instead of the map's West Rhovanion (it could be the Vales of the Anduin, which is now probably a sub-HQ).
Celduin/Iron Hills: I believe Celduin stretched a bit more northward, separating Erebor and the Iron Hills.
Khand: I think Khand also stretched more northward, connecting to Rhun behind Mordor's opening.
Crossroads/Morgul Vale: Currently it looks like there's an unlabeled region between Osgiliath and Minas Morgul. I think this would be the Crossroads, but Morgul Vale would also be in that general location (and was also in the old RP). The Morgul Vale should be between the Crossroads and Minas Morgul, and (on a related note) should have Cirith Ungol running between it and Mordor, alongside Minas Morgul.
For clarity purposes, CC, I think it would be helpful if you mentioned which locations were HQs and sub-HQs on the map. Here's the lists, at least of what it looks like they'll be.
HQs:
Bree
Mirkwood
Erebor
Dale
Edoras
Minas Tirith
Moria
Dol Guldur
Rhun
Isengard
Mordor
Harad
Sub-HQs:
Rivendell
Lothlorien
Iron Hills
Beornings (location undecided, perhaps Vales of the Anduin, The Carrock, or somewhere else in that vicinity)
Fangorn Forest
Dol Amroth
Goblin-town (just below the High Pass)
Gundabad
Khand
Dunland
Minas Morgul
Umbar
And last, but certainly not least, this is what I think our region list should be, after everything I mentioned above (excluding HQs, organized geographically starting from the Northeast, crossing the Misty Mountains, and then moving past Ithilien covering south of the White Mountains).
North Ered Luin
Grey Havens
South Ered Luin
The Shire
Old Forest
[Bree]
Weathertop
Lone Lands (Weather Hills)
Trollshaws
[Rivendell]
Minhiriath
Cardolan
Hollin (Eregion)
Tharbad
Enedwaith
[Dunland]
Druwaith Iaur
Adorn
[Moria]
Redhorn Pass
[Goblin-town]
High Pass
Evendim
North Downs
Ettenmoors
Angmar
Forochel
Forodwaith
[Gundabad]
Grey Mountains
Withered Heath
The Carrock
Gladden Fields
[Vales of the Anduin]
[Mirkwood]
Central Mirkwood
[Dol Guldur]
East Bight
[Erebor]
[Dale]
Esgaroth
Celduin
[Iron Hills]
West Rhovanion
Dorwinion
[Rhun]
South Rhovanion
Old Brown Lands
Dimrill Dale
[Lothlorien]
Celebrant
[Fangorn Forest]
The Wold
Gap of Rohan
[Isengard]
Helm's Deep
[Edoras]
West Emnet
East Emnet
Eastfold
Emyn Muil
Noman-lands
Dagorlad
Morannon (The Black Gate)
[Barad-Dur]
Anorien
North Ithilien
Cair Andros
Henneth Annun
Crossroads
Morgul Vale
[Minas Morgul]
Cirith Ungol
Osgiliath
Pelennor Fields
[Minas Tirith]
Emyn Arnen
South Ithilien
Crossings of Poros
Harondor
[Harad]
[Khand]
[Umbar]
Pelargir
Lebennin
Belfalas
Tolfalas
[Dol Amroth]
Lamedon
Anfalas
Andrast
So that makes twenty-four HQs/subs, and sixty-seven regions, if I counted correctly
Lots of stuff, ok. I'll take your point one by one.
The Crossroads is on the map. It is in the inset I added of Ithilien, due to the regions being too small to get names in there adequately.
Pelennor fields and Belfalas were certainly not in the old RP, nor should they be in this one.
I can certainly change weather hills to Lone lands.
The Eastfold and Westfold were very small, and were actually smaller divisions within the West/east emnets. It's a common misconception, so I decided to right it, and call them by their true names.
I saw a void where Nindalf was, and figured there wouldn't be any harm adding it in. If you'd like it to be named Noman lands instead, I can do so.
As far as Rhovanion is concerned, I can do some readjustments, but making Rhovanion three separate topic seems excessive.
Most of those adjustments seem fair. As far as Crossroads/morgul vale goes, I have the inset to see that region better. Morgul vale was just too small to fit in, and to be honest, I don't see a reason to have it.
Just a couple notes on this:
- I'm not entirely convinced about the relationship between the East/Westfold, and East/Westemnet. However, what you have seems mostly accurate, so I think it's fine. The only question I have is whether we should add Eastfold as well, like we had in the old RP. By having one giant Westemnet region, that would allow people to go strait from Anorien to Fangorn or the Gap of Rohan, with only one day of travel time. That seems like a bit of a stretch. While it may be a slight canonical issue, I think adding the Eastfold region would be much more balanced.
- Noman-Lands was more to the east of Nindalf, between Dagorlad and N. Ithilien. Nindalf itself is a marsh, so travel through there would be virtually impossible. At least, that's what we decided previously, but it could be changed.
The day of prosperity makes one forget adversity; The day of adversity makes one forget prosperity.
Lots of stuff, ok. I'll take your point one by one.
The Crossroads is on the map. It is in the inset I added of Ithilien, due to the regions being too small to get names in there adequately.
Pelennor fields and Belfalas were certainly not in the old RP, nor should they be in this one.
I can certainly change weather hills to Lone lands.
The Eastfold and Westfold were very small, and were actually smaller divisions within the West/east emnets. It's a common misconception, so I decided to right it, and call them by their true names.
I saw a void where Nindalf was, and figured there wouldn't be any harm adding it in. If you'd like it to be named Noman lands instead, I can do so.
As far as Rhovanion is concerned, I can do some readjustments, but making Rhovanion three separate topic seems excessive.
Most of those adjustments seem fair. As far as Crossroads/morgul vale goes, I have the inset to see that region better. Morgul vale was just too small to fit in, and to be honest, I don't see a reason to have it.
Just a couple notes on this:
- I'm not entirely convinced about the relationship between the East/Westfold, and East/Westemnet. However, what you have seems mostly accurate, so I think it's fine. The only question I have is whether we should add Eastfold as well, like we had in the old RP. By having one giant Westemnet region, that would allow people to go strait from Anorien to Fangorn or the Gap of Rohan, with only one day of travel time. That seems like a bit of a stretch. While it may be a slight canonical issue, I think adding the Eastfold region would be much more balanced.
- Noman-Lands was more to the east of Nindalf, between Dagorlad and N. Ithilien. Nindalf itself is a marsh, so travel through there would be virtually impossible. At least, that's what we decided previously, but it could be changed.
- I am quite positive that what I said is correct The West fold is a smaller region between Helm's Deep and Edoras, and the eat fold is a smaller region between Edoras and Gondor. I've had to do this research many times. In my WIP3 image, I added the east fold as it's own region.
-hmm OK, well if we need it changed, I can do that.
I saw that, though I didn't notice a (clear) label for it (on either the main map or the inset).
I thought they were, but maybe not. I don't know much about Belfalas, but I think if we keep the Morgul Vale and the Black Gate as separate regions, it would be good to include the Pelennor Fields. If we're giving Barad-dur and Minas Morgul each their own entry regions, I think we should give Minas Tirith one too.
That'd be good, just to keep things as much the same as before for the sake of keeping things clear.
I figured it was something like that, but I'm not too knowledgeable about much south of Dol Guldur. I do think it would be good to separate the southern section of the West Emnet into another region though (next to Anorien), just from a geographical/logistical standpoint.
Insert third paragraph here.
Rhovanion was a huge area. From what I can tell, it covered about a hundred and fifty thousand square miles (three hundred by five hundred miles) from Mirkwood to Dorwinion, Celduin to the Ash Mountains. I would offer that we give the area some other names, except that all of the maps I've seen are pretty much blank in the area I just mentioned. Dorwinion was relatively small and was tucked between the Sea of Rhun and the River Running, while the Brown Lands end at the eastern edge of Mirkwood. The empty space in between can really only be called "Rhovanion". So on that, I suggest you tuck Dorwinion into the space between the Sea of Rhun and where you currently have it (and between the River Running and those mountains to the south) (as is canonical), combine your current Dorwinion and East Rhovanion into West Rhovanion (or north) (and maybe separate the East Bight, too), and then make the empty space just below all of that into Southern Rhovanion.
And that's good, I just could find the labels very well in there. I remember us having the Morgul Vale before, so I thought I'd bring it up.
@you and 8L: On the subject of the area around the Anduin, I think the number of regions we have is pretty good. I think we should rename CC's West Rhovanion to Vales of the Anduin to make it clear that it's away from the other Rhovanions, but otherwise it looks good to me. We do need to figure out exactly where the Beorning HQ will go, though. As far as I can tell, Beorn's hall was just east of the Carrock, and as Beorn was known to frequent the Carrock, I think it could be made into their HQ fairly well (combined with the nearby land, including the hall). separate the HQ a little, we could make the rest of the current Carrock region into the Wilderland.
Fixed Crossroads
I was always opposed to Morgul vale existing, it just seems like extra Morgul troops. But I suppose we can add in a Pelennor to counter that. (As long as we actually have the Rammas Echor ) Belfalas I know, as leader of Dol Amroth, was never part of the RP.
I added an East Fold region bordering Anorien, East Emnet, West Emnet and Edoras. I don't know if you want a West Fold too?
I fixed Rhovanion, as I will show in the next map.
I changed the name to Vale of the Anduin.
I also italicized all the names of HQs or subs
Of course it would include it. Huh, maybe it was just mentioned in CNHQ/T.
That's up to whoever the leader is. I see no problem in having that sort of styling for Rhun, nor is there a problem with ditching that and going with something else. As far as I can tell, it's just the aesthetic of those troops, which isn't too important.
Ok, but that is simi-heavy armor, I don't think lion used them but I think others might. You just said to have ruhn be made of cav archers, not infantry and I wanted to make sure it passed the KK test. I think they should get a heavy cav unit. If you look up "rhun Kataphracts you shoud see what i'm talking about.
Actually, now that I think of it, those might be better under Khand. They're still Easterling troops, but I think the heavy infantry would fit better under Khand than Rhun. Obviously Rhun would have more than just chariots and cavalry archers, but those are where its troops should excel most. Heavy cavalry also seems fine, mainly since no one else on evil really has heavy cavalry (since Harad is light). Again, most HQs will have most kinds of units, what I'm talking about right now is just where they excel. Rohan is free to have infantry, but clearly its strength lies in cavalry. Same goes with Rhun and its chariots (and horse archers), and Harad with its light cavalry.
HQ's and Sub-HQ's maybe, although I'd prefer the larger ones. Regions need 1,000 however.
I don't understand your reasoning. We need the ratio of HQ MWE to Region MWE to be constant. If we are going to lessen one, we have to lessen the other.
Why do we need it too be constant. Also, Their is no point in keeping a region if you don't get at least 1K from it: It'll be a drain on your recourses if their is so few defenders. Also, I prefer the larger HQ numbers anyway, so let's just keep it as they are now.
Tul Generas of the Orcs, Darthraxx of the dragon Knights. I RP, and have lots of fun.
