That's what seems to make sense to me. Of course, multiple HQs have cavalry, but Harad seems more inclined to cavalry than the others do, to me. Khand would be battle-wains, though I'm not quite sure what Rhun would be (I'm struggling to remember Lion's old units ). Harad obviously has Oliphaunts, but outside of them I think they're mostly light infantry and cavalry. Goblin-town would be the most stealth-oriented HQ, as Goblins are small, and are known for their craftiness.
I would say that Harad should have very good light infantry, and good light cavalry, as well as camels and ok horse arrchers plus mumkil. But the real cavalry nation should be Ruhn/Khand.
Harad is definitely light troops, with a slight focus on cavalry. I think just about any light cavalry of theirs will be relatively good, along with their light infantry and Oliphaunts. On the other hand, I know of no evidence that Rhun or Khand were particularly noted for their cavalry in any way. At the very least, we know that the Haradrim used a relatively large amount of cavalry in the Battle of Pelennor Fields. I just read "The Battle of Pelennor Fields", and found a few quotes to indicate this: "Southward beyond the road lay the main force of the Haradrim, and there their horsemen were gathered about the standard of their chieftain." "[After Theoden had destroyed said chieftain.] Then all that was left unslain of their [the Haradrim's] cavalry turned and fled far away." ". . . from the southward fields came footmen of Harad with horsemen before them, and behind them rose the huge backs of the Mumakil with war-towers upon them." ". . . Riders had passed clear through the ranks of the Southrons, discomfiting their horsemen and riding their footmen to ruin." That was every quote from that chapter that mentioned the Haradrim troops (besides just their Oliphaunts). Although they certainly had infantry in that battle, they also were confirmed to have cavalry too (and I don't know that any of the other evil armies were). The repeated emphasis on their cavalry would imply that said cavalry made up a notable portion of their forces. I didn't see a single instance where Haradrim infantry were mentioned but not their cavalry. There was but one mention of non-Oliphaunt Haradrim troops in that chapter that I could find (and it was simply "Southrons in scarlet" mentioned alongside Easterlings, Variags, and Men from Far Harad). As for Rhun, the only two specific Easterling tribes mentioned in detail were the Wainriders and Balchoth. All we really know about the Wainriders is that they used wagons and chariots in battle (TG cites Appendix A, "The Númenorean Kings", "Gondor and the Heirs of Anárion" as the source for this). The Balchoth, on the other hand, were most certainly not cavalry-heavy (though related to the Wainriders). According to TG, "They had crude weapons and few horses, used mostly for drawing their large wains." (cites The Unfinished Tales, "Cirion and Eorl and the Friendship of Gondor and Rohan") Although Rhun would certainly have chariots and wagons in its army, this information leads me to doubt that they would have any significant amount of conventional cavalry within their militaries. Of course some cavalry is acceptable, but I don't see anything to indicate that they would have a lot of cavalry, are especially good cavalry, unlike Harad. Khand I can find no real information on. On TG, there is a little bit of etymological evidence mentioned that could imply that Tolkien likely though of them as mercenaries, but even that says little. The best I have, from the chapter I read earlier, is ". . . Gothmog. . . had flung them into the fray; Easterlings with axes, and Variags of Khand, Southrons in scarlet, and out of Far Harad black Men like Half-trolls with white eyes and red tongues." These two evidences make me think of the Variags as medium infantry, but I really can't bring up anything to support that idea. We still have far more evidence to show that, if any, Harad would be the cavalry HQ.
OK, so we seem to be thinking of having Skin-Changers/Beornings.
First off, I haven't read the books in ages. So my assumptions may be wrong.
Now:
1. Does it say anywhere that the Beornings are Skin-Changers? I got the impression that Beorn was the last. I don't remember Tolkien saying that his descendents received the ability.
1B. I know some of you are going to talk about the Bear company that assembled outside Beorn's house in the Hobbit. There is no evidence that they were Skin-Changers. They could just have been Bears loyal to Beorn.
2. Are the Beornings large enough for a sub-HQ? I may be incorrect, but I got the impression they were only a few dozen of them.
2B. I ask the same of Esgaroth and Bree.
1. From Tolkien Gateway: "Skin-changers were creatures who could take different forms at will. Little is known of their abilities; the only famous skin-changers were Beorn and his descendants (who could take the shape of a Man or of a bear),[cites The Hobbit] but evidently other skin-changers also existed." I think that regardless of whether we call them Skin-changers or Beornings, we will specifically be using the actual Beornings, because those are the only Skin-changers that we have information on. As for there being other Beornings/Skin-changers, here's a quote from The Hobbit, "The Return Journey": "Beorn indeed became a great chief afterwards in those regions and rules a wide land between the mountains and the wood; and it is said that for many generations the Men of his line had the power of taking bear's shape, and some were grim Men and bad, but most were in heart like Beorn, if less in size and strength." So it seems clear that there were at least some Beornings after Beorn himself.
2. The Beornings alone, probably not. However, it seems that their sub-HQ is going to mostly consist of woodmen, with Beornings as some elite units.
2B. I'm not entirely sure I understand what you're asking, but I can only assume that you're asking if these locations have enough people to be HQs/sub-HQs. Esgaroth I really don't know. I honestly am not sure about how many people were left there after Dale was rebuilt. However, it is one of the most logical sub-HQs for Dale (alongside the Vales of the Anduin, and perhaps Dorwinion). As for Bree, it's more of a "Confederacy of the Free Peoples of Eriador" HQ based in Bree than it is an actual Bree HQ. In addition to Bree-men, it also includes the Dunedain, Hobbits of The Shire, and Men from other towns and the countryside. Bree is simply the HQ because it seems to be the most significant and most centrally-located town, and it would serve as a good base of operations for the included peoples.
That's what seems to make sense to me. Of course, multiple HQs have cavalry, but Harad seems more inclined to cavalry than the others do, to me. Khand would be battle-wains, though I'm not quite sure what Rhun would be (I'm struggling to remember Lion's old units ). Harad obviously has Oliphaunts, but outside of them I think they're mostly light infantry and cavalry. Goblin-town would be the most stealth-oriented HQ, as Goblins are small, and are known for their craftiness.
Goblins are stealth troops? well, whatever. I might use that to my advantage. . . Sod Boxers, now more.
They seem more inclined to stealth than most other evil races. I mean, they're small, light, agile, crafty, and can move rather quickly and quietly.
GUYS GUYS!! I have a wonderful Idea! Have any of you played the War of the Ring board game?
Wow, I seem to be very late to the party. Kinda bummed about that. Too busy, I guess....
Are we doing a Dol Amroth HQ? I'd be thrilled to get my Swan Knights back. Otherwise I'm happy to leader wherever you need me.
Several ideas that I can contribute to:
1. I think an official RP map is long overdue. I have had one in the works since my last spurt on the LOTR RP, and would love to finish it.
2. I think I have a great Idea to improve the Roleplay quality of the Third Age RP. What if we have a Fellowship of the Ring? A group of RPCs who have posession of the Ring. Like the War of the Ring Board game, they can do whatever they want with it. They can try to send the entire fellowship south as fast as possible, and try to destroy it, or they can hide in Rivendell or something like that. Heck, they could even use the ring! This way there are two ways for both sides to win: Militarily, or by destroying/finding the ring. After the Ring is destroyed/recovered, the RP would reset. Also maybe the individual RPCs in the Fellowship could give boosts in strength to Armies they join? Like say some of the Fellowship breaks off, and goes and helps with the defense of Erebor. The Dwarves would either get a MWE bonus, or simply an RPC bonus to help them fight.
What do you think of that Idea? That way we increase the Roleplay quality, as RPCs are used more heavily, and it would provide a new more engaging dynamic to the conflict.
No I have not, though I'll have to look into it now.
Sort of. We seem to have decided on a sort of variation on HQs. Not only do we have six full HQs for each side, but each HQ also has a sub-HQ that has its own ten thousand troops (with some unique unit types) and regeneration capabilities, but is under command of the members of the main HQ and can also be captured (for a reduced bonus to the new owner). Dol Amroth isn't its own HQ, but is rather the sub-HQ of Minas Tirith. So if you want to join Gondor, you could use at least some troops from Dol Amroth.
1. If you want to finish it up and give it to us (or even just give it to us so we can finish it), there won't be any complaints.
2. That could be interesting. Right now I think we should focus on getting the RP up and running, but this is something that we could keep in mind for future reforms. It could perhaps sabotage the long-term strategies of capturing territory, but it may be worth it for the extra twist. Of course, there are also other issues that would need to be sorted out first. For one thing, I feel like the Ring-bearer would be awfully exposed to enemies, as all it would take is a single evil army placed to be able to intercept the fellowship. And it's also quite possible that the Ring could be rushed through to Mount Doom even before the RP made much progress, seeing as how it'd only take a couple of weeks to cross all of Middle-earth, yet battles can last months.
Yep, all sounds good. Beornings would be awesome Oh wait, I have to fight them
So Harad is the cavalry? I thought that was Khand and Rhun? Harad is also the stealth troops then, correct?
That's what seems to make sense to me. Of course, multiple HQs have cavalry, but Harad seems more inclined to cavalry than the others do, to me. Khand would be battle-wains, though I'm not quite sure what Rhun would be (I'm struggling to remember Lion's old units ). Harad obviously has Oliphaunts, but outside of them I think they're mostly light infantry and cavalry. Goblin-town would be the most stealth-oriented HQ, as Goblins are small, and are known for their craftiness.
Hmmmm, fair enough. I don't really know, I haven't read LotR for 3 years I think 8L might have Lion's old units? Ah yes, the infamous Oliphaunts I feel as though Harad may be the next in stealth after Goblin Town, or very similar.
One mod to rule them all and in the darkness ban them - Lord of the Mods "I am the Mod Reborn!" - masterlegobuilders I'm the real boss
GUYS GUYS!! I have a wonderful Idea! Have any of you played the War of the Ring board game?
Wow, I seem to be very late to the party. Kinda bummed about that. Too busy, I guess....
Are we doing a Dol Amroth HQ? I'd be thrilled to get my Swan Knights back. Otherwise I'm happy to leader wherever you need me.
Several ideas that I can contribute to:
1. I think an official RP map is long overdue. I have had one in the works since my last spurt on the LOTR RP, and would love to finish it.
2. I think I have a great Idea to improve the Roleplay quality of the Third Age RP. What if we have a Fellowship of the Ring? A group of RPCs who have posession of the Ring. Like the War of the Ring Board game, they can do whatever they want with it. They can try to send the entire fellowship south as fast as possible, and try to destroy it, or they can hide in Rivendell or something like that. Heck, they could even use the ring! This way there are two ways for both sides to win: Militarily, or by destroying/finding the ring. After the Ring is destroyed/recovered, the RP would reset. Also maybe the individual RPCs in the Fellowship could give boosts in strength to Armies they join? Like say some of the Fellowship breaks off, and goes and helps with the defense of Erebor. The Dwarves would either get a MWE bonus, or simply an RPC bonus to help them fight.
What do you think of that Idea? That way we increase the Roleplay quality, as RPCs are used more heavily, and it would provide a new more engaging dynamic to the conflict.
No I have not, though I'll have to look into it now.
Sort of. We seem to have decided on a sort of variation on HQs. Not only do we have six full HQs for each side, but each HQ also has a sub-HQ that has its own ten thousand troops (with some unique unit types) and regeneration capabilities, but is under command of the members of the main HQ and can also be captured (for a reduced bonus to the new owner). Dol Amroth isn't its own HQ, but is rather the sub-HQ of Minas Tirith. So if you want to join Gondor, you could use at least some troops from Dol Amroth.
1. If you want to finish it up and give it to us (or even just give it to us so we can finish it), there won't be any complaints.
2. That could be interesting. Right now I think we should focus on getting the RP up and running, but this is something that we could keep in mind for future reforms. It could perhaps sabotage the long-term strategies of capturing territory, but it may be worth it for the extra twist. Of course, there are also other issues that would need to be sorted out first. For one thing, I feel like the Ring-bearer would be awfully exposed to enemies, as all it would take is a single evil army placed to be able to intercept the fellowship. And it's also quite possible that the Ring could be rushed through to Mount Doom even before the RP made much progress, seeing as how it'd only take a couple of weeks to cross all of Middle-earth, yet battles can last months.
Their is actually similar to the Hero idea that we attempted (and are still attempting kind of) in the Fourth Age RP. But yeah, let's not ruch into it. Also, I have not seen that Board Game I don't think.
Tul Generas of the Orcs, Darthraxx of the dragon Knights. I RP, and have lots of fun.
I might as well claim Dale before someone else does. For my second HQ I will pick Mirkwood.
We need a leader for each HQ not just a member.
*updated list*
@ Legobuilder
Here is the post where I claimed Dale. I suppose if you realy wanted Dale I could take mirkwood, but I would prefer Dale.
Darn it. You claimed it 3 hours before me. I am going to head south to Gondor and take up the role of Steward, and then be assistant King under the Mountain to KitKat.
OK, so we seem to be thinking of having Skin-Changers/Beornings.
First off, I haven't read the books in ages. So my assumptions may be wrong.
Now:
1. Does it say anywhere that the Beornings are Skin-Changers? I got the impression that Beorn was the last. I don't remember Tolkien saying that his descendents received the ability.
1B. I know some of you are going to talk about the Bear company that assembled outside Beorn's house in the Hobbit. There is no evidence that they were Skin-Changers. They could just have been Bears loyal to Beorn.
2. Are the Beornings large enough for a sub-HQ? I may be incorrect, but I got the impression they were only a few dozen of them.
2B. I ask the same of Esgaroth and Bree.
1. From Tolkien Gateway: "Skin-changers were creatures who could take different forms at will. Little is known of their abilities; the only famous skin-changers were Beorn and his descendants (who could take the shape of a Man or of a bear),[cites The Hobbit] but evidently other skin-changers also existed." I think that regardless of whether we call them Skin-changers or Beornings, we will specifically be using the actual Beornings, because those are the only Skin-changers that we have information on. As for there being other Beornings/Skin-changers, here's a quote from The Hobbit, "The Return Journey": "Beorn indeed became a great chief afterwards in those regions and rules a wide land between the mountains and the wood; and it is said that for many generations the Men of his line had the power of taking bear's shape, and some were grim Men and bad, but most were in heart like Beorn, if less in size and strength." So it seems clear that there were at least some Beornings after Beorn himself.
2. The Beornings alone, probably not. However, it seems that their sub-HQ is going to mostly consist of woodmen, with Beornings as some elite units.
2B. I'm not entirely sure I understand what you're asking, but I can only assume that you're asking if these locations have enough people to be HQs/sub-HQs. Esgaroth I really don't know. I honestly am not sure about how many people were left there after Dale was rebuilt. However, it is one of the most logical sub-HQs for Dale (alongside the Vales of the Anduin, and perhaps Dorwinion). As for Bree, it's more of a "Confederacy of the Free Peoples of Eriador" HQ based in Bree than it is an actual Bree HQ. In addition to Bree-men, it also includes the Dunedain, Hobbits of The Shire, and Men from other towns and the countryside. Bree is simply the HQ because it seems to be the most significant and most centrally-located town, and it would serve as a good base of operations for the included peoples.
I also just found this proving that the Beornings where active in the War of the Ring.
" Misty Mountains were crawling like anthills: orcs were issuing out of a thousand holes. Under the boughs of Mirkwood there was deadly strife of Elves and Men and fell beasts. The land of the Beornings was aflame;"
Breaking of the fellowship. FoTR
I think that proves that the Beornings where active and fighting in the WotR.
I would say that Harad should have very good light infantry, and good light cavalry, as well as camels and ok horse arrchers plus mumkil. But the real cavalry nation should be Ruhn/Khand.
Harad is definitely light troops, with a slight focus on cavalry. I think just about any light cavalry of theirs will be relatively good, along with their light infantry and Oliphaunts. On the other hand, I know of no evidence that Rhun or Khand were particularly noted for their cavalry in any way. At the very least, we know that the Haradrim used a relatively large amount of cavalry in the Battle of Pelennor Fields. I just read "The Battle of Pelennor Fields", and found a few quotes to indicate this: "Southward beyond the road lay the main force of the Haradrim, and there their horsemen were gathered about the standard of their chieftain." "[After Theoden had destroyed said chieftain.] Then all that was left unslain of their [the Haradrim's] cavalry turned and fled far away." ". . . from the southward fields came footmen of Harad with horsemen before them, and behind them rose the huge backs of the Mumakil with war-towers upon them." ". . . Riders had passed clear through the ranks of the Southrons, discomfiting their horsemen and riding their footmen to ruin." That was every quote from that chapter that mentioned the Haradrim troops (besides just their Oliphaunts). Although they certainly had infantry in that battle, they also were confirmed to have cavalry too (and I don't know that any of the other evil armies were). The repeated emphasis on their cavalry would imply that said cavalry made up a notable portion of their forces. I didn't see a single instance where Haradrim infantry were mentioned but not their cavalry. There was but one mention of non-Oliphaunt Haradrim troops in that chapter that I could find (and it was simply "Southrons in scarlet" mentioned alongside Easterlings, Variags, and Men from Far Harad). As for Rhun, the only two specific Easterling tribes mentioned in detail were the Wainriders and Balchoth. All we really know about the Wainriders is that they used wagons and chariots in battle (TG cites Appendix A, "The Númenorean Kings", "Gondor and the Heirs of Anárion" as the source for this). The Balchoth, on the other hand, were most certainly not cavalry-heavy (though related to the Wainriders). According to TG, "They had crude weapons and few horses, used mostly for drawing their large wains." (cites The Unfinished Tales, "Cirion and Eorl and the Friendship of Gondor and Rohan") Although Rhun would certainly have chariots and wagons in its army, this information leads me to doubt that they would have any significant amount of conventional cavalry within their militaries. Of course some cavalry is acceptable, but I don't see anything to indicate that they would have a lot of cavalry, are especially good cavalry, unlike Harad. Khand I can find no real information on. On TG, there is a little bit of etymological evidence mentioned that could imply that Tolkien likely though of them as mercenaries, but even that says little. The best I have, from the chapter I read earlier, is ". . . Gothmog. . . had flung them into the fray; Easterlings with axes, and Variags of Khand, Southrons in scarlet, and out of Far Harad black Men like Half-trolls with white eyes and red tongues." These two evidences make me think of the Variags as medium infantry, but I really can't bring up anything to support that idea. We still have far more evidence to show that, if any, Harad would be the cavalry HQ.
You have a point. My thinking of that comes from a game, and the old rp.
Here is what the FoTR says about the easterling army. " out of the East Men were moving endlessly: swordsmen, spearmen, bowmen upon horses, chariots of chieftains and laden wains."
There tolkien calls out bowmen upon horses, and chariots of chieftains and laden wains. So I think that rhun/khand should get at least good horse archers, if not great lancers.
That's what seems to make sense to me. Of course, multiple HQs have cavalry, but Harad seems more inclined to cavalry than the others do, to me. Khand would be battle-wains, though I'm not quite sure what Rhun would be (I'm struggling to remember Lion's old units ). Harad obviously has Oliphaunts, but outside of them I think they're mostly light infantry and cavalry. Goblin-town would be the most stealth-oriented HQ, as Goblins are small, and are known for their craftiness.
Hmmmm, fair enough. I don't really know, I haven't read LotR for 3 years I think 8L might have Lion's old units? Ah yes, the infamous Oliphaunts I feel as though Harad may be the next in stealth after Goblin Town, or very similar.
I do have his old units, he has a lot of chariots but not so many cavalry units.
For my second HQ I will pick Mirkwood. 
Oh wait, I have to fight them 
I thought that was Khand and Rhun? Harad is also the stealth troops then, correct? 
