I believe you are referring to the Yalta conference, in which the Big Three accepted Soviet control over much of eastern Europe in order to gain their support against Japan. It was not an under the table deal between Churchill and Stalin, in fact Churchill hated the deal.
Also, are you aware Stalin had Zhukov draw up plans for a Soviet invasion of France and Italy in 1945? Stalin was disappointed he only went all the way to Berlin, where Alexander I had gone all the way to Paris. Stalin wanted to go further, he wanted to go all the way to Spain! This operation was only called off because he feared Nuclear retaliation.
No i'm talking about a separate meeting, Churchill laughed and called it "That Naughty little paper". Not to mention What about Patton, and Curtis Le may, they wanted to invade the soviets a lot of Americans did, I'm not saying the Soviets are good, I'm not Saying the US is good, I say their both Evil Powers, I'm also not a person that would go fight the government, I can tell you why not to.
The US is not evil, and never has been. Yes, the US has done some pretty bad things. That doesn't make it evil; it's more of an antihero.
That's where you're wrong. Not all powers are the same. Some countries, like North Korea, Nazi Germany, and the USSR became powerful by forcing their people to follow them. But, on the other hand, there's democracy. Countries like the US, Germany, Japan, and a bunch of others are powerful, and have become powerful by giving their people freedom to have their own power. I'm not claiming that any countries are perfect. I'm just saying they're not inherently evil.
Looking at my immediately previous post, you can't possibly hope to tell me the Soviet Union were the victims.
The Yalta agreement was a tragedy and one of the biggest Allied mistakes of the war. We carelessly abandoned our allies in Poland and Churchill was heavily criticized by the British Parliament for daring allow Stalin to annex half of Poland (the western half was ostensibly "free" but became a communist puppet). This is known to the Polish as "Western Betrayal," I strongly oppose it myself.
Stalin promised that the other eastern countries would be liberated (no mention of annexing the Baltic states was made in any of the Big Three conferences). These were blatant lies and freedom was nonexistent until after the Cold War ended.
As far as aggression -- the Soviet Union backed aggressive forces in North Vietnam, North Korea, South America, Cuba, and Grenada, in many cases violently overthrowing democratic governments and committing war crimes on national television to create fear. The Soviet Union also directly invaded Afghanistan in the late years of the Cold War. The United States and her allies worked with the defensive forces in many of these countries and sometimes ran covert operations of our own to prevent the spread of communism.
The "nuclear bombs" statement of yours is somewhat inaccurate -- that's part of our nuclear sharing program, in which Belgium, Germany, Italy, the Netherlands, and Turkey participate. The weapons are guarded by US airmen in peacetime but officially belong to the host countries and are to be used by those countries in times are war. We did not force those countries to host our weapons; they signed onto this program for their own defense. We have never supplied nuclear weapons to Mexico.
Putin's aggression is also somewhat more serious than you seem to believe. You realize he militarily annexed a large section of a neighboring country that contained a strategic port, right?
As far as NATO being US-dominated: I'm sure you'll be happy to hear that President Donald J. Trump is considering leaving the US-dominated organization because many Americans are tired of being the only line of defense for 27 countries. The main reason that the United States "dominates" NATO is because the other member countries are unwilling or unable to defend themselves. Friends of mine who live in NATO states close to the border like Poland and Ukraine have voiced their concerns that Russia may invade them if the US stops providing their defense.
I'm not saying the Soviets are good, but America isn't any better, they do the same thing, all powers do. Oh and America Wasn't being aggressive in afghanistan, How many coups and assassinations? Just because they were more organized doesn't excuse them.
America is aggressive, they are installing satellites in Poland trying to take the South China sea, THESE ARE ON RUSSIA AND CHINA"S BORDERS< I never said there were bombs in mexico, I asked would it be exceptable for russia to move bombs into Mexico, would that be alright, everyone would say he is aggresive, rightly so! but its somehow different with Poland? Also if you looked into it Crimea overwhelmingly wants to be with Russia, its been part of their country for centuries before, only in the 90's did it get taken away, its like Canada taking Virginia from us. As for Trump, he's a bafoon and already lied about that he is going to stay plus its not like he has any power right now.
America, with the freedoms it offers, is no better than the USSR? America's "aggression" in Afghanistan was in response to attacks that foreign terrorists made on us as well as an attempt to remove a horrifying regime. Many countries aided us and are still there with us.
I've never heard about us installing satellites in Poland, and the only country trying to take the South China Sea is China, who have been illegally creating artificial islands and military installations in other nations' waters.
We don't have bombs in Poland. I literally just listed all the locations that share nuclear weapons.
Crimea is 50/50 Ukrainian and Russian and the decision is still split. Ukraine declared independence from the Russian Empire in 1918, not the '90s. It's also nothing like Canada taking Virginia... it's like Viriginia leaving of their own free will.
Your statement about Trump has no objective facts in it, so I'm just going to entirely ignore it.
✠✙ What once was old doth fade away/But Former Glory stays the same ✙✠ •••Unity•••Duty•••DESTINY••• ***EST. 2006*** • 9/11/01 • BCC: 2010-2014 • EX-TER-MIN-ATE! –Dalek
Aggressiveness isn't the only reason people hated the USSR. It's the fact that their government was authoritarian and single-party.
We're pretty much the same, now I don't like the Soviets on their Atheistic stance but we have 2 parties which don't have that much difference.
Yes, the two big parties in America didn't have much difference. But, if someone wanted, they could form any number of new parties. And they're allowed to do that. The fact that people are allowed to follow any party they want is one thing that makes countries good.
Truman is tied for one of my least favorite presidents of all time, so I can't exactly say I approve of what he did. The Truman Doctrine isn't aggressive, though -- it's supposed to aid in the defense of countries attacked by communist forces. Even if it was aggressive, it doesn't alone stack up against the many Soviet infringements.
"The Marshall Plan (officially the European Recovery Program, ERP) was an American initiative to aid Western Europe, in which the United States gave over $12 billion (approximately $120 billion in current dollar value as of June 2016) in economic support to help rebuild Western European economies after the end of World War II. The plan was in operation for four years beginning April 8, 1948. The goals of the United States were to rebuild war-devastated regions, remove trade barriers, modernize industry, make Europe prosperous once more, and prevent the spread of communism."
This isn't even a military plan or aggressive. It's an economic recovery plan. We offered the same plan to the Soviet Union and they refused. The Soviet Union created the "Molotov Plan" as a reactionary measure, but it was not effective and instead of working to economically rehabilitate countries, it actively tried to suppress the regrowth of former Axis nations.
Stalin invaded Poland in 1939 alongside Hitler. NATO was not more aggressive than that.
And Just why do you think the US was helping europe, good will toward men?
No, but we did help them to build relationships. Economic and political friendships that have lasted for seventy years. Japan and Germany were devastated by the war, and in the case of the former was totally destroyed by America, but we came back and rebuilt them and they are grateful for both the reconstruction and for liberating them from the totalitarian regimes that controlled their nations.
✠✙ What once was old doth fade away/But Former Glory stays the same ✙✠ •••Unity•••Duty•••DESTINY••• ***EST. 2006*** • 9/11/01 • BCC: 2010-2014 • EX-TER-MIN-ATE! –Dalek
Actually, the US played an important part in WWII because we defeated the Japanese.
America provoked Japan to war so their involvement is America's fault but yes they did defeat them.
As you know, my mother is Japanese. At least nine, maybe more of my relatives were Japanese casualties of the war. I strongly do not appreciate you carelessly saying something as insulting and false as that "America provoked Japan."
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In the United States, you're allowed to believe whatever you want to believe. You can hate the government and still live in America. You can hate democracy and we won't arrest you. You can run in elections and vote for people in order to change government policy. The constitution of our country specifies that it is the right and duty of the people to stand up and revolt against tyranny.
In the Warsaw Pact nations, you were monitored. Your phone might be tapped or any of your friends or relatives might be an informant. In one case in East Germany, a wife and a husband were spying on each other for the government. Speaking out against the government, even in private, was a very dangerous affair and if the secret police heard about it you would never be seen again. The Soviet government controlled the economy and also dictated what citizens were allowed to believe. It's a horrible reality that only those who have lived under it can fully understand, and it's because we live in the free world that you currently don't comprehend just how bad the USSR was.
America's citizens do not just "do whatever the government tells them." With the exception of laws meant to protect society, we are free to do and believe whatever we want.
Not always the case, in the 50's you could be called a commie for anything bad said about America, Soldiers don't have freedom of speech, I mean when in the army as well as out with some things, were wiretapped, far worse than the soviets. Freedom Of Speech is actually quite limited.
In the '50s (Truman's administration -- remember how I hate him?) during the Red Scare, yes. It was never that bad before or after.
✠✙ What once was old doth fade away/But Former Glory stays the same ✙✠ •••Unity•••Duty•••DESTINY••• ***EST. 2006*** • 9/11/01 • BCC: 2010-2014 • EX-TER-MIN-ATE! –Dalek
Aggressiveness isn't the only reason people hated the USSR. It's the fact that their government was authoritarian and single-party.
Were pretty much the same, now I don't like the Soviets on their Atheistic stance but we have 2 parties which don't have that much difference.
We actually have hundreds, if not thousands of parties, including the Green Party, Libertarian Party, and multiple Communist and Nazi Parties. Two of these parties, the Republican and Democratic Parties, are the largest and are similar in some ways (they're really wildly different in terms of policy and belief...), are the most-broadcasted and are typically the only ones to be elected to the office of President, but third-parties are elected to city, county, and state offices quite often.
We also don't make you disappear forever if you don't vote for the official party.
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You'll note in my follow-ups just how inaccurate that statement is.
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Not always the case, in the 50's you could be called a commie for anything bad said about America, Soldiers don't have freedom of speech, I mean when in the army as well as out with some things, were wiretapped, far worse than the soviets. Freedom Of Speech is actually quite limited.
In the America of the 1950s you could be arrested for virtually anything. These days, communism is not as big of a threat as it was during the Cold War. Note that I did not say communism isn't a threat at all, it still could be.
Besides the Civil War, I'd call Cold War America the darkest time in the nation's history. While trying to stop communism, the US came dangerously close to being a communist nation.
I will say that Freedom of Speech is much more limited then it sounds like it should, but a whole lot of junk would be widespread if Freedom of Speech was unlimited.
The US did provoke the attack on Pearl Harbor, although Roosevelt was trying to prevent war and such a violent retaliation was uncalled for.
My two cents on what's being discussed here. But honestly, this is a chatroom, not a debate. If you really want to argue about things that already happened and won't change, set up a debate topic.
No i'm talking about a separate meeting, Churchill laughed and called it "That Naughty little paper". Not to mention What about Patton, and Curtis Le may, they wanted to invade the soviets a lot of Americans did, I'm not saying the Soviets are good, I'm not Saying the US is good, I say their both Evil Powers, I'm also not a person that would go fight the government, I can tell you why not to.
The US is not evil, and never has been. Yes, the US has done some pretty bad things. That doesn't make it evil; it's more of an antihero.
Whatever, I can't find one Nation that isn't evil and has evil ambitions, like I earlier said, its depends on your definition of Evil.
America provoked Japan to war so their involvement is America's fault but yes they did defeat them.
America wasn't provoking Japan. We didn't even want to be in the war in the first place; Japan provoked us with Pearl Harbor.
Well America always wanted in anyway but that's my opinion, America cut their Oil production so they knew they would have to conquer to get Oil for their army and other projects, Pearl harbor had just recently have the entire Pacific fleet move their, Pearl harbor was the Pacific fleet and Japan would have to take it out to get the oil they needed, plus what about the Flying Tigers in China fighting Japanese?
